Feed the Right Wolf

Hi everyone,

My husband was supposed to disclose everything to me last night and it did not go well. Basically it ended up me asking him questions and him getting angry because he wouldn't say anything and really just gave a bunch of excuses or somehow made me part of the problem which is ridiculous.

Do you have any advice on how a disclosure should go and what should be in it?

I would like the story from beginning to end, the how, why, when's. I would like to know it all even things that he finds petty because to me they are not at all. I need this to heal and also so I know what I am trying to forgive.

I just wanted him to give me his story, all of it, without reservations and half truths. After he was done I was planning on asking questions if I had any but this is not at all what happened. He did not come prepared and had not even thought about what he was going to say to me.

Is this a lost cause? Am I asking too much?

Cappy

_________________
Good sex begins when your clothes are still on. --William Masters & Virginia Johnson

Cappy

Cappy-

Sounds like one tough conversation. Put yourself in your husband's footsteps for a minute. He's probably really embarrassed about the whole situation and the process of coming clean with it to you. This addiction is a very private one for most people and he probably never imagined he would be sharing it with anyone, let alone you. I'm not sure of the particulars of your relationship, but hopefully you guys are having this conversation because you want to salvage your relationship. I would suggest taking a softer approach.

Maybe you could write him a letter expressing everything that you feel. Explain that you love him and that you want this relationship to work, but you need complete honesty. I would skip over the gory details. Do you really care what he was looking at? I personally know that the addiction will make you look at things you never thought or dreamed of. It has little to no reflection on what you are really attracted to. I think the more important thing is that he was out of control with his habit and he should realize how it hurts you and your relationship.

Suggest that he get some help - via a therapist or a blog like this. And tell him that you love him. Be good to each other and good luck.

Hi Fap,

I have written numerous letters to him and talked to him and explained how I feel and that he needs help and that I would support him and he does nothing, he still treats me like shit. Honestly right now I do not care if he is embarrassed and he needs to learn how to deal with it. No kidding its private he chose to have sex with a computer and his hand for 18 years ( i am only 38) without me, for 18 years he chose that over me and I had nothing, I have been waiting for him to get his shit together for 18 years, it needs to stop. If I didn't want to salvage my relationship I would not still be here, I have tried and done everything and he does not take me seriously and continues to be selfish and put himself first, he does not listen to me. He has major issues that he needs to seek help for but does nothing, he says he will and has been saying that for 18 years and still has done nothing. Even since I found out about this 3 months ago when I caught him every week he says he is going to do things to fix himself and help with his problems and he still hasn't, he just keeps blowing smoke up my ass. Well enough is enough and I kicked him out last night and said that until I can see proof that he wants to change and what he is going to do he is not welcome back.

I don't care what he was looking at I want to know what the hell happened in our life, in my life. I need to know why he chose his hand and a computer over me and when this started and how and why. I need to know what he was doing and how often and I need to know how he plans to stop.

I have been suggesting help for years, he has been to 4 counselors and lied to all of them, he keeps saying he is going to post on here and has been saying that for months and still hasn't, he started an online course and barely did anything and has now stopped altogether and even when he did do it the few times I had to remind him to and tell him to.

I always tell him I love him all the time and I show him to he just does not want to see it and I am really starting to think it is him that does not love me.

_________________
Good sex begins when your clothes are still on. --William Masters & Virginia Johnson

Cappy

First of all - congratulations on making this decision that you are going to be happy regardless of the BS that comes out of him. It may be a good thing that he didn't have much to say actually. A lot of addicts are full of half-truths and rationalizations. Some addicts are great talkers and they can talk and talk and talk and blame this or blame that. But it is all BS from an addict. Actions speak louder than words.

I just hope that you are asking him to leave so that you have space to work on YOURSELF. Don't do this because you hope this will change him, or he will finally see the light. That means you are co-dependent on him. If he comes around, then you will be happy. If he doesn't change, then you will be angry and frustrated. You need to spend this time thinking about what you want out of life. What is something you want to do that you haven't done in a while? Call up an old girlfriend from high school and ask to go out for a coffee to catch up. Try to make at least one new female friend this month and keep the friendship up. Join a gym and work-out. Your happiness should not depend on what your husband decides to do. You did that for 18 years, and it did not work.

I think that in addition to moving out, there should be no contact between you guys for 30-60 days. The reason is so that you both work on things for yourselves and not depend on the other person. You must begin to let go of your attachment to him, because his actions have proven that he does not seem to care about your feelings. If you are happy regardless of him, then his actions only affect him. All his bullshit about being with the same woman from such a young age, he wanted to see what it would be like with other women is classic addict BS and rationalization. Sure, on the surface, maybe to some people it sounds like it could be true - but trust me, that is just addict BS.

Congratulations on not falling for it and kicking him out of the house. But save yourself another few years of heartache and pain - and focus on YOU. Don't give two shits about what "progress" he is making, or what work he has done. Think about YOU and only you. You need to be happy regardless of what your husband is doing because it is the only way you can find happiness. You didn't look at porn for 16 years. You have tried to support your husband through this, which is more than 90% of the women out there would do. Please have someone take the kids (grandparents?) and go out and do something you enjoy - maybe its a local wine tour and then a night out at a bed and breakfast, maybe its a country bar with a girlfriend, maybe its a round of golf followed by an ice cold pint at the pub (ok - maybe thats my favorite!), maybe its dressing up and going to a show at the local theater with your sister. Only you can make yourself happy, and right now it seems as though your happiness is dependent on what your husband decides to do about HIS addiction.

For healing,

JJ

Unfortunately I have to have contact with him we have two kids.

_________________
Good sex begins when your clothes are still on. --William Masters & Virginia Johnson

Cappy

What I meant was no discussions about his progress or what he is doing towards bettering himself. I would let him worry about his addiction and how it has negatively affected his life, and hopefully you can focus on your own happiness. This way you can detach the emotional link between you and your husband for a period of time. Right now your happiness in life depends on whether or not your husband becomes the intimate partner you hope for. That is not healthy because you have no control over what he does or thinks.

What if you catch him again 3 years from now? That would be another 3 years wasted. What do YOU want? Go get it. And if your husband comes around, then great! And if not, at least you are happy and he has to deal with the feelings of losing 20 years to pixels on a screen. It is his screw up, not yours. And saying "I want my husband" is not a good goal because you have no control over that.

I know it must be unbelievably terrifying, especially since you have been with him for so long. That's why you need a safety net because you will fall many times, and they need to help you stand up again. You need some new girlfriends who will remind you from time to time, that your husband chose porn over you for 18 years. Letting go is brutal. It is traumatic. It is like someone you love has just died, someone you have been with since you were 17.

Find a safety net, throw up a rope and climb out for some fresh air. Just for a month or two. Experience life without depending on validation from your husband. I hope you trust that I am saying this because I think it will actually help your marriage in the long run.

You are extremely strong to do what you have done already. Congratulations, that must have been one of the hardest things you have ever done.

I hope you keep posting here. I am trying to offer support the only way I know how.

Hi JJ,

I hear what you are saying, I just don't know if I can do it.

It is so hard because I do not just leave people, any people, it is not in my nature to do so. My sister at one time had a horrible boyfriend that used to beat the shit out of her and he would not allow me to see her so I would send pamphlets every week to her by mail for battered women and I would address the envelopes with my left hand so she did not know it was me sending them. She was so messed up and scared that she cut us out of her life, her family and we are a very very close family, we didn't talk for months and months but I did not give up on her, I couldn't.

I feel the same way with my husband, he has been with me for so long and I can't just give up on him. Not even for me but for him, I want him to be well and I want him to have a good life. Plus where would he go?

I also think of my kids and they need a family together, this would devastate them. I don't even know what to say to them.

This is extemely hard for me, all of this. I know I can't make him do anything and I honestly don't want to make him do anything, I want him to want it and me himself. I agree that he cannot come back here unless he has a plan, really wants to improve and talks to me openly and honestly about what went on with no games of his. He has to want to change for himself definitely and for no one else and he will not come back here unless that is genuine and true. I don't think I can kick him out for a month or two if he is sincere about getting help and asking for help, if he is genuine about wanting to change and is putting in the effort. I want to support him and help him within reason if he is putting in the effort and committment himself. I have set my boundaries and he knows them and if he honours them and is making a real effort to change and I can see it then that is all I am asking for and need. I understand if he has slips and that it is hard, I do not expect him to change overnight since he has been this way even before he met me so a lot of work is needed. However, if I can see and feel that his heart is in this marriage and that he wants to improve himself and be with me then I will not deny him a life with me and be in our home.

Maybe I am being stupid I don't know and I will pay for it in the end but I cannot just give up on someone I love so much like that. I am going to continue to work on myself and am quite proud of what I have accomplished so far. I know I don't deserve this and I know I am a good person and I know that I am a strong person. I will not put up with shit anymore, I won't do it but I am willing to work on my marriage if my boundaries are met and my stipulations ie: him getting real help, him wanting real help, me seeing him getting real help, him putting in the effort with me and me seeing and feeling it, then I am here for him 100 percent and will stay with him and support him anyway he needs me to. I want to do that and I want to be able to be the wife I always wanted to be. I love this man more than anything, more than myself so I will not give up on him yet but I will not sell myself out either.

I really wish my husband would come on here and talk to you guys. He has some major issues and needs someone other than me maybe to tell him what he is doing.

Thanks JJ for your help, you are a great person and I thank you for all of your words and advice.

_________________
Good sex begins when your clothes are still on. --William Masters & Virginia Johnson

Cappy

I wanted to leave this alone because I feel like I have said too much already. But why on earth would you feel like you are giving up on him? The only person you are giving up on is yourself if you continue to depend on your husband for your happiness and mental well-being. You say it is not in your nature to "leave people", but haven't you left yourself somewhere in the past 18 years? What do you like? What do you enjoy doing? Where are your friends? You are trying to take care of everyone else (sister), but what about you? You want your husband to be well and have a good life, but what about you? You worry about your kids, but aren't they hoping for a happy, fulfilled and present mom?

Agreeing to focus on yourself and not him during this time is not "giving up" on him. You are handing his addiction over to him to work on, while you focus on yourself. It is the best thing you could possibly do for him and for yourself and for your children.

You say you that you will accept him back if he works on things and doesn't cross any boundaries. What happens if he does? Will that make you upset and angry? Will you accept a slip up? How many slip ups will you accept? You see, if you are happy living your life anyways, his slip ups only affect him because you will still be happy. You say you love him more than you love yourself.

Did you have abandonment issues in childhood? Were you expected to be a caregiver even as a child? Did you have to take care of your parents or siblings in some way?

He made a decision to choose porn over you for 18 years. That is purely his selfishness. Discovering this brought you to a crisis. You didn't ask for this crisis but it happened for a reason. I think you need to work through and express the anger of feeling worthless and ugly for years while your husband looked at his computer screen. And you need to reconnect with the happy teenager you left on the side of the road many years ago. She really wants to meet you too.

We are here for you,

JJ

Hi jj,

You have not said too much, no one can say too much:)

Just so you know I do do things I like still and that make me happy. For instance this weekend I was alone which was nice:). I played with my dogs, I went and had a picnic in a park, I slep outside and watched the meteor shower, I listened to some music, I drank some yummy wine and had a nice long bath, I stayed up and watched the sunrise:). I had a good weekend with myself. Yes I missed my husband and wished he shared all of those things with me but I still had fun and enjoyed myself as much as I could.

I was a bit of a caregiver as a child I am the oldest sibling and I looked out for my sister and brother at all costs. When I got a bit older in my teens my dad developed a brain tumor and started drinking again and then I wanted to look out for my mom too. Even through all of this though I have still done things for me and continued with what I enjoyed.

I have done some focus on me and have completed my workshop at recovery nation for partners which has really helped a lot and made me find my values and boundaries again which I am now enforcing and living by again. I do still have self esteem issues because of this but I am trying to work on them as well. I am an active participant in this forum as well as on the one at recovery nation to get support and also to provide support to others because I enjoy doing that. Some things I think just take time to heal, a long time. I will still see friends and I do have quite a few even though I hid out this weekend and turned down a couple offers from girlfriends to do something, I did what I felt was best for me at that time. I just wanted to be alone with myself and do what I wanted to do without talk and peace and quiet.

If he does cross my boundaries then I expect him to admit that he did and genuinely be sorry with a real apology. Not twist things and make excuses and try to blame his actions and choices on someone or something else. If he slips, which I expect to happen not often or all the time but I would not be surprised if it did and yes I would be hurt but it is the lying that hurts more. If it happened I would expect him to tell me about it then that day not hide it and pretend it didn't happen and keep me in the dark about it. If he tells me then we can work through it together and that is all I want. If it is a total relapse where he chooses porn and his hand to take over my role as a a wife again then it is over final. I will not live as a roomate anymore and if that is what he wants then he can tell me that and move on before this shit happens again. He owes me that.

I am trying and working very hard to connect with the happy teenager that I once was and I will find her again with or without him.

I know all of this has been him and his ways and ideas and thoughts that I cannot even slightly comprehend at all because they are so screwed up. Some ways of how he is I think started before all of this and I honestly think he has a personality disorder that helped cause this addiction. His head is just not right and from the sounds of it was not right even before the p&m started. One good thing is after talking to him this weekend and making him see how his is and him acknowledging it he says he knows he has a major problem and says he is going to mental health today for an assessment and they can then refer him to the help he needs for addiction and any other issues he may have as well. This is a good thing but I am only still waiting to see if that actually happens or if it was just another story that he has fed me. He also says he has created an account on here and will start posting as soon as he gets a login, I hope this is true as well and will help him see other sides of things and will maybe believe others opinions and get support from them to help him.

I guess I will find out if these first steps that he says he is going to take and actually want to take happen in the next couple of days. If they don't happen then I know that he was just lying to me again for his benefit and he won't be coming home at all until he is ready to prove to me that he wants help, is willing to put in the work and wants to be with me as a husband and not a roomate.

_________________
Good sex begins when your clothes are still on. --William Masters & Virginia Johnson

Cappy