Feed the Right Wolf

Hi jj,

I will see if I can find the book. You are right I do not believe I am codependent and the things I did do were for myself as well, I needed to feel good about myself too. I also believe in compromise in a marriage and doing things for each other too. I want to look good for myself and my husband, I want him to feel good about himself because he makes me happy and I want him to be proud of me and who he choose to be with, which is how I want to feel about him too. Problem is that I am the only one who seems to want this. I have started to just check out I guess now and am trying not to let how he acts and behaves affect me but it is very hard. It is extremely hard to be rejected continuously by the person you choose to be with and love. Even this past week we went camping for 5 nights with family and friends and nothing from him. I made arrangements for our kids to sleep in a tent outside of our trailer so we would have it to ourselves and nothing, no talk, no sex no nothing. The only time we spent any time together alone was when I asked him to come with me to take our dogs for a walk which took 20 mins in pretty much silence becAuse he never said anything and one other short time in our trailer when we were kissing and he had a sneeze attack that went on forever but even after that and him apologizing which was on like the first day there he never tried to initiate anything again, conversation or anything else. I was not mad that he had a sneeze attack and told him stuff happens but that was the end of it and he never tried anything again really and didn't talk to me either. So the whole time we were together could have been alone many times and he fell asleep on me, never talked to me and pretty much ignored me the whole time even when I made it so we had the trailer to ourselves, asked him to go for a walk with me, tried to have a nap with him "nap was our code word" but nap time is me alone now I guess. Even me getting changed at night in the trailer alone together, me standing in front of him in just a bra and undies and putting on my Pjs did nothing because I was slow changing one night on purpose to see what would happen and he stared at the ceiling the whole time. I watched him to see what he would do, to see if he would show any interest or say something and he didn't. He said nothing and stared at the ceiling the whole time. Makes me feel just awesome.

My mom started asking me what was wrong with him even and I just said I didn't know, she started asking if he was sick or something because he was so disengaged with everyone and not even coming remotely close to me at all, stayed as far away as possible. I am tired of making excuses for him and just won't anymore. He talked to everyone elsJe it seemed, played games with them, rode bikes and boat rides with the kids, went fishing alone, just avoided me like usual. I tried to have a good time even though that was going on but it does take its toll on me. I was hoping for a good time away with him on our big camping trip of the summer, made preparations and came up with a plan so we would have alone time and nothing. He even used our dogs as an excuse not to come and have a nap with me:(. My sister went out fishing with her husband for quite awhile, my eighteen year old nephew took his gf for a 4x4 adventure and alone time up the mountain for awhile, my brother snuck in alone time with his fiancé even though they had another person sleeping in their trailer, my friends snuck off for naps and long lunches etc and I got to watch everyone else get that and be important to their significant others but me. It really hurts me to see that but not have it at all and I am now just too tired and fed up with me having to chase it all the time. I am tired of being the one initiating everything and having to be the one to even try. I am tired of being the only one who puts themselves out there and I'm the only one who is getting rejected, it really hurts me and I can't do it anymore. I tried again after the week before of rejection and and him reading my posts etc and still nothing. I am still alone with no partner and just some guy that hangs around our house.

Now we are home again and no apology or explanation just petty talk about washing the dogs, cooking chicken left over from camping, laundry just dumb stuff not what is needed in a relationship. He watched a movie with our daughter instead of dealing with this and instead of dealing with it he hid out and said nothing and did nothing and went to bed for the night on the couch without a word to me. I don't understand what is going on. Ya there are crappy days sometimes or regrets or things don't quite work out right that is life. You cannot hide from life and if you don't want to be in it with me then get out. I think I try really hard and do things still even though I know I shouldn't right now because it is him that needs to prove he wants to be here with me not the other way around. I think and do everything, I planned the camping trip, I figured out a way to have the trailer to ourselves, I used our nap code word he didn't show up and yes he knows what it is because it is a joke between us, he fell asleep on me twice and the other times that he didn't you could tell he wanted to go to sleep and being with me was not because he wanted to but because he felt he had to and I can feel that and figure it out so slept on the couch the rest of the nights, I stood there basically naked in front of him and he didn't even glance my way or notice, I asked him to go for a walk with me, I made him breakfast everyday, I say thank you for making me dinner and bringing me a drink etc, I do appreciate when he does things but it is stuff that he does for everyone really not for just me or to be with me, I have been patient and supportive when he does something but that is rare so what am I supposed to do here? Even when we are in the same bed he sleeps as far away from me as possible, even when I give him the side of the bed he prefers. He used to say he couldn't breath properly which is why he always slept with his back to me and now when I do give him the side he prefers he still does it so what's the excuse now then? This is all just rejection of me all of it and it is not ok, it hurts me a lot and it keeps happening all the time. I don't understand why if he says he wants to be here with me. I tell him that it Hurts me, he reads the posts and sees the words that say his actions or lack there of and zero communication hurts me yet he keeps doing it, why? He is still shutting me out and is making no attempts to even let me in, that says to me that he does not want me. I understand that things may be hard or the porn has messed up his head so much but he stopped that 4 months ago and I have been supportive even though I have heard terrible things from him and still I am here, where is he? He says all these things but dosent do any of them. If you can't remember write it down then if it's important to you and I have said this a million times and he has done it once which was great because he actually did it and said it was helpful and he completed his list, hasn't done it again though since and is back to all talk and no action. How is that supposed to make me feel? Surely not good and it is just another slap in my face over and over again, it puts me back to the day I found out about the p&m. Promises and words that just never come true, they are just words with nothing behind them, false committments and that lying to me. If you tell me you want something and that you are going to do certain things to get it and do nothing, nothing of what you say you are going to do to get what you say you want then that is lying and it is deceiving me again into believing things that will just never happen and are just not true. Actions speak louder than words especially now.

I don't know what to do and am just tired of it all.

_________________
Good sex begins when your clothes are still on. --William Masters & Virginia Johnson

Cappy

Hi Cappy,
I am following your story and was saddened to hear that your hopes of a responses from your husband did not eventuate.
You are trying incredibly hard and I commend you for that. As someone who has lacked affection in the past myself, I can totally relate
to the problem and problems with lack of affection can hurt sometimes more than problems relating to sexual dysfunction.
I hope you find things improving in coming weeks.

_________________
Kind regards, CSC

"I wished for nothing beyond her smile, and to walk with her thus, hand in hand, along a sun-warmed, flower-bordered path. (Andre Gide)"

Been a NEW MAN since: April 16, 2012

Hi CSC,

What I find so frustrating is if you read his posts he is making my mind up for me. He has no idea how I feel, he never asks me and he never talks to me so how would he know? I tell him all the time over and over but he dosen't listen to what I say and then makes things up in his head about what I think or how I feel. He admits doing it and says he is going to stop assuming but does he? No. He just did it in his post last night again, he had no idea what I am thinking or how I feel and I don't tell him anymore because it is a waste of time it does nothing, he dosen't hear me and dosen't seem to care at all because he just keeps doing the same things over again and again. It is ridiculous.

If I hated him would I still be there? He says he is going to and wants to use me as support but never talks to me or asks anything ever. He says he loves me and needs me and wants me but stays as far away from me as possible, does not initiate a damn thing ever and rejects me still.

He acts like a selfish brat to be honest and I get that he says he feels shame and does not know how to cope with it, well use the tools available then, figure out how to deal with it. Try at least, really try not just say you are going to try actually do something. Maybe he dosen't want to do anything, I don't know but if that is the case then that is a whole other problem. I refuse to be his sister, roommate, buddy, whatever, I am his wife and if he does not want a wife then so be it and say that then.

A wise woman on here says there is a difference between shame and guilt and I 100% agree with her. Shame is still selfishness somewhat and making it all about yourself where guilt is different, it is about how you feel about what you have done that has affected others.

Here is an article that explains the difference:

http://www.afterpsychotherapy.com/shame-and-guilt/

Not sure where to go from here honestly but I am not ignoring the problems and his behaviours which he seems to think is ok. I will not engage with him until this is sorted out and I have said this a ton of times before so it's not like I have not set my boundaries and consequences before, I refuse to be treated this way and I have told him this. It is not right and I am a person, one that is supposed to be important to him. If he dosen't want to be with me then why won't he just say that then.

I just read his post and even that is frustrating to me. He says there are so many things I do and so many ways that I am that please him yet I won't accept his compliments. What compliments? If he ever says anything it's good morning cutie or good morning beautiful by a text message. That does not count, what is that? Plus none of his actions back up anything. A compliment is not something that needs to be pryed out of you, I should not have to ask for them or try and figure out what he is thinking all of the time. If I try and find out what he is thinking I end up with nothing because he shows no emotions at all. I have no idea what he is thinking, wanting, needing, liking, hating, desiring I don't have a clue and never do. A compliment is not valid if it is forced or if I have to ask for one. It is given freely because you feel something or think something or like something. He gives no compliments, he never talks to me.

I am tired of reading how he is so sorry to have ruined me and my life, tell me to my face then if you are so sorry. Do something about it then, make amends. So now he has bought a notebook to write in well that is good I guess but how is that talking to me? Writing on here is not talking to me, doing his workshop is not talking to me, writing in a notebook is not talking to me. Sure all of those things are wonderful to do and I am sure may help but they are not addressing the problems he has with me. It is still not including me in his life, it is still shutting me out. It is fantastic that he writes all these things about me on here as well as other things but not good that he dosen't share them with me ever. It is also not good that he writes how I feel and how I think yet never even asks me so how would he know? He does not talk to me, he does not touch me, he does nothing with me. So how in the world would he know anything about me? I try and talk to him but he does not listen when I do or absorb anything I am saying, he dosen't even pay attention. Tries to change the subject all the time, makes excuses, twists my words, makes up my mind for me, takes what I say and turns it into whatever he wants to hear. I am not a nasty person, I am not asking for insane things. I am a good person and I deserve to be loved and listened to and talked to, that is all I have ever asked for and wanted. I do not want to be last in my husband's mind and thoughts, I do not want to be avoided and shut out, and it hurts to be rejected all the time by him.

I am very frustrated and stressed because of this and it is out of my control.

_________________
Good sex begins when your clothes are still on. --William Masters & Virginia Johnson

Cappy

I am having a great day today:) Crazy busy at work but other than that I am feeling good!

Only one thought that made me pretty sad today but I got past it relatively quick which makes me happy.

My husband and I had a good talk last night and that has helped. I think it was productive and it has set some things in motion.

He is such a good man and I wish he would show it all the time, I love him very very much.

Looking forward to our time together tonight wink wink!!!

_________________
Good sex begins when your clothes are still on. --William Masters & Virginia Johnson

Cappy

Very happy for you, Cappy.
I am following your story with interest. Stay true to yourself. You will never give up on those you love.
I was thinking about you the other day and I have a youtube song to share. Listen carefully to the words.
I think your Healing Day is coming.....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CMiYIxWCTfM

_________________
Kind regards, CSC

"I wished for nothing beyond her smile, and to walk with her thus, hand in hand, along a sun-warmed, flower-bordered path. (Andre Gide)"

Been a NEW MAN since: April 16, 2012

Hmmm, so I am in a bit of a pickle.

Things have been ok in some aspects and not ok in others.

I will state the good first:

I am a huge Halloweener and my husband and I throw a big Halloween Party for us adults every year. There is a lot of planning, creativity and money involved (sometimes). Last year was terrible and in the thick of his p&m. My husband basically bashed our party, why we do it and that is was not worth it. This hurt me tremendously and I don't think he even realized it. Halloween has been a huge part of my life since I was a little girl, my parents made a big deal of it and it carried on with me. It is important to me for so many reasons, it's fun, gets my mind off work stresses, lets me be creative and use my imagination, brings my friends together for a good time (everyone looks forward to it every year and people ask to come), bring my kids and family together to put it together with ideas, crafts, etc, I get to plan something fun for me and my husband and friends/family, I look forward to it every year. When he said he hated it last year because of all of the money invested, all of the work, all of the clean up, all of the time etc it really really made me sad. Funny thing is he barely did a damn thing, I did it all not him. If I did need him to do something I asked and had to keep asking and asking until he did it a few days before the party. He never helped he complained, whined, procrastinated and put what was so important to me last. There are so many things that I don't even think he realized how shitty he was being, so mean, such a complete asshole. Everything was about him and in so many ways still is.

This year I am so happy to say that he is helping!!!! He is showing enthusiam and adding input and ideas, which I love!!!! It is our party, not mine, ours and it makes me feel good to be able to have fun with him planning and creating with him. So awesome:)


The bad is that he is still full of plans and ideas to help him improve himself and change yet he does not follow through and does not seem to find the importance in his ideas and why he needs to follow through and make a priority of them. He says he is going to do the following:

Post on here everyday
Do 3 lessons a week minimum in his recovery workshop
Talk to me uninterrrupted for an hour once a day
Have date nights
Communicate with me
etc.

These are his plans, these are what he thinks will help him and these are things he says he wants to do but he never follows through. He has time he just always finds something else to do instead. IE: instead of doing his lessons or posting on here he plays games on the computer or checks his email or goes on facebook etc. When we talk the kids are there and that is not uninterrupted, it lets him talk to them instead of me.

He just got back from his psychologist appointment and he thinks my husband's fear of being real in front of me is the reason he acted the way he did. He thinks he is so scared to not be who I think his is that he hides. WTF? How is this about me again? I have never done a damn thing to my husband except love him and I am tired of being the cause and blame of his selfish choices, self centredness, lack of compassion and empathy, lack of social skills, ignorance to others wants, needs, feelings, he has no emotions at all. How am I the source of this I would like to know?

_________________
Good sex begins when your clothes are still on. --William Masters & Virginia Johnson

Cappy

Today's thought.

My husbands fear is that I won't like him and this is why he turned to porn and masturbation for 18 years of my 38 year life.

Well wake up I don't like you and it's because of who you choose to be. It is your lying to me, disregard for me, shutting me out, selfishness, putting me last, making my mind up for me and assuming how I feel and think, your lack of responsibility and accountability, ignoring and avoiding me, your poor you, your excuses and blame, how you have and still do treat me. This is you, this is the only you I have ever seen and you are right I don't like that person. And guess what else your lack or drive and continuous lies about your bigs plans, dedication to recovery and real want to get there is pissing me off and making me not like you more, you are deceiving and lying to me about it, you are sucking me in and giving me false hope because you are not taking any of it seriously, not really.

You are scared I wouldn't like you? What after two years of me being with you, you just all of a sudden think I won't like you even though I buy a house with you and stay with you for 20 years through this shit, marriage and kids. What a load of crap!!! So unless this was going on the whole 20 years and you are deaf, blind and dumb then I guess you could use that as a reason.

Really how would acting like this ever make me like you? Wake up and realize that who you have chosen to be and still are is who I don't like and that guys time is gonna run out!

Enough already!!!!!

_________________
Good sex begins when your clothes are still on. --William Masters & Virginia Johnson

Cappy

All I read from my husband on here is poor him for that month the whole time he has been on here. Yes I have distanced myself but really I am acting no different that he does. I will talk about petty things like dinner, hockey, the dogs etc but that's it. He wants to live like roommates then that is how we are living. He is so devasted by the shame, guilt and memories of the ruining of our marriage, really cause he's not doing anything about it. You do not get a wife to cater to you and not have to act like a husband. I am protecting myself from him and how he acts now. If he wants to shut me out then so be it be he will not have me like he has for years, I will not play into his bs. If he cannot talk to me and cannot meet the plans HE says he wants and is going to do to improve himself then fine that is his choice, do nothin then but I also have a choice in how I will be treated and ignored and left in the dark is not one of them. If he has intimacy problems and emotional immaturity then I guess he needs to work on that and he refuses to. He has ways but just dosent want to do them and continues to shut me out. I do not deserve this and I will not allow him to treat me this way. I am doing nothing more than treating him like he treats me but for some reason it's ok if he does it but not me. What a joke. Funny he can do and act however he wants but I can't. I could never be unfaithful yet he could look at porn and masturbate everyday for 18 years and that was ok for some reason that wasn't cheating yet it sucked every bit of life out of our relationship. He can ignore, avoid and reject me but I can't even stand up for myself and say no I will not talk to you about important things through text message, you need to tell me what you are thinking, you cannot put me and this marriage last, it is not ok to avoid me and watch tv instead, it is not ok to keep me in the dark about your recovery and the work that needs to be done on him to deal with emotions and intimacy, it is not ok that he tell me something and never do it, it is not ok to be with someone that never thinks of you and how you feel and have no support or that they don't even try to make you feel better, they ignore you. It is not ok, none of this is ok and I will not allow I anymore. I am not one of those wives checking on him every second of the day or installing computer programs to spy on him and I am not hounding him about this but I will not be shut out either and I deserve to know what is going on and to be talked to.
He is so selfish and it's only him that matters. I am doing nothing more than act like him, distancing myself from him so I don't hurt more but being rejected and ignored again. He avoids me and that is it and I will not chase him to be a part of my life or fight to be a part of his any longer, how come it's me doing all the work and all he does is poor him and wallow in his self pity. He can't even see how this is for me and dosent even try. He dosent check in to see if I'm ok or even ask me anything about it. It's all about him and poor him, well guess what asshole this is the life you chose, you wanted this for years and it was the most important thing to you so guess what I am not doing anymore for you because you won't even do a damn thing for yourself. You won't let me in so that is your choice again and you are abusing me emotionally and I will not allow you to do that anymore to me. You want to wallow in self pity then go ahead I am moving on with me and you can sit there oh poor you and sink. I am so pissed off at you and your childishness, think only of yourself and be alone

_________________
Good sex begins when your clothes are still on. --William Masters & Virginia Johnson

Cappy

So I have not talked to my husband for 11 days, this has been his choice.

Because of this and my boundary of communication among others I have disengaged with him. This was the consequence of him violating my boundary. If he will not talk to me then I will disengage from him as I refuse to be shut out of his world any longer and if that is the way he wants it then I am only going to focus on myself and my recovery. Every boundary i have listed (I actually typed it up for him and stuck it to the wall at the end of July because he kept ignoring them) he continues to violate. Things like respect, honesty, communication, committment, hard work, fun, sex etc.

Now here is the thing early last week he walked all over them again so I stood up for myself and said you have again violated my boundaries and I am distancing myself I will not engage in petty talk or pretend there is no problem and you can sleep without me. So a week goes by with him making no attempt to rectify the situation or talk to me and then he violates them again so I said ok you still aren't getting it so another week and I will not sleep with you or engage in petty talk with you. We have things to discuss a lot and he keeps avoiding me and ignoring me.

Now I read his post and he says he is ignoring me because I told him too. That is absolutely not true. In my boundaries I have clearly laid out that if he violates them then I will disengage with him until the time that he can respect them. So I never once said that he could not talk to me bu he does have to talk about what is going on here and not dumb shit that really dosent matter. We need to talk about him, me and our relationship and I never once said that he could not do that. Now he is twisting what I have said and written into what he wants to hear to again justify how he chooses to act. What the hell is going on here?

I have morales, values and boundaries and I will now stand up for them. I let my own values slide while he way acting out for years hoping that things would change and I was grasping at anything to get them too. Now I know what is going on and see how I lost myself and what I believe in because of his behavior choice and I have worked hard to find that again. These are. It crazy things, they are things that need to be in a relationship and should have always been there caring, trust, honesty, real meaningful communication, fun, thoughtfulness etc.

So why now when I lay what I will and will not put up with on the table does be use it against me? Omg!!!! I am not a warden here, I want a real and healthy marriage and he still cannot step out of his box and be uncomfortable a bit to make this work. He should have his own damn boundaries too but he dosent because he has done no real work yet. I said once he respects my boundaries then I will be more than willing to move on with him but he just can't do it, he is still violating them by using them against me and saying shit that I just did not say and it makes me furious how he can take my words and make them into whatever he wants the to be and what he wants to hear.

So pissed off right now.

_________________
Good sex begins when your clothes are still on. --William Masters & Virginia Johnson

Cappy

Not feeling too great today. I have a headache that is no fun, it is affecting my vision and advil is not working. It is just awesome because I work on a computer all day. I went to bed with a headache and woke up with a headache and I can't get it to go away now I am going to try and drink a ton of water. Hopefully that helps some. The stress is getting to me and having no one to talk to is making it that much worse. My husband is awol and has not been around for 12 days now by his choice. It amazes me how he thinks that none of this affects me or dosen't want to see or do anything about it anyhow. It is beyond me how you can only think of yourself when it is obvious how much someone you say you love is hurting and you do nothing but ignore them.

Tomorrow is my son's birthday party and I will have fun there with him and family (no help on this either from my husband, oh wait today he asked if we needed to get a cake, hmmm well considering it is tomorrow and you offered no help of any kind until right now, I think I have figured it out on my own, thanks) and then Sunday I have to work at a wedding fair and honestly I just want to tell all those women to think twice about getting married, make sure you know everything about your husband before you do it, really really know, I thought I knew and really I was married to a fake selfish man, one that portrayed himself as something totally different and hid things from me and lied and deceived me for 20 years and even now when we are in the thick of despair because I found out what was really going on he is still no where to be found and I am still alone in this marriage. The truth is I have never had a marriage and I have not worn my wedding ring in over a year (I took it off last year before I even knew this was going on because there were major problems and he would not listen to me so I took it off and told him that what we had was not a marriage it was a roommate situation that I did not sign up for so I was taking my ring off until I had a real marriage, funny how this didn't give him any incentive of any kind to stop with the p&m he just kept on doing it and lying to me about it until I caught him a few months ago). The real sick part of this whole thing which stabs me every time I think about it is that his first ring broke and he didn't have one for awhile so while we were having problems (due to his p&m which I knew nothing about) I bought him a new ring as a present and made it a symbol of starting over and improving things and that I cared about him and loved him very much, I put myself out there again and dedicated myself to him again. He then a few months later bought me a new one as well to match his. Why did he do that? So he lied to me and deceived me when we said our vows and I got the first ring and then he did it again when he gave me the second one and he also did it both times when he accepted my rings to him. It makes me sick and I will never wear any of those rings again, to him they obviously mean nothing to him but to me they were a symbol of our marriage and what it should have been full of honesty, truth, love, caring, respect, support. It was me giving myself to him, all of me. My mind, my love and my body. It was me saying that I loved him more than anything and that I was dedicating my love to him and only him, that I would support him and care for him and love him in all ways, I would stick by him and honour him and do anything and everything in my power to make him happy and have a good life. His rings to me meant nothing, not a thing, they were just that rings and nothing more. It hurts me so much to know that am I alone and have always been. I have been willing to start over a ton of times, to improve things to get our marriage to a marriage, to change myself, have always told him how I have felt and he has seen it as well, intiated sex even when he rejected me over and over and wanted it (he has hardly ever intiated in 20 years), let him pursue his outside interests even if it was inconvenient for me or took away from time with me, supported him in his workplace even though the first fews years were difficult and frustrating as he was trying to get full time (I actually took the intiative and sent in his application for this job for him because he didn't think he would get it and didn't even apply or try to), I put my own career on hold for him, I had our first child because he wanted one even though I was hesitant and felt it was too soon and I was too young, I planned and thought of everything we have done alone ie: vacations, concerts, sporting events, I have been present and available to him this whole time and he has just never showed up and still won't.

I am getting a bottle of wine tonight for sure!!!

_________________
Good sex begins when your clothes are still on. --William Masters & Virginia Johnson

Cappy